Is This Why The Scientific Community Hates Intelligent Design?
February 7, 2008
On an internet forum recently, a young lady named Hope asked why the scientific community is so overwhelmingly against Intelligent Design (ID). Specifically, she wondered why so many scientists not only reject ID but also seem to scorn those who propose it?
My friend Eric responded to her question. Eric is a scientist and I’m republishing his reply to Hope because I believe it is quite revealing of what scientists expect from each other and why proponents of ID “just don’t fit the bill”:
Hope,
There is a very real phenomenon of prejudice within the scientific community towards ID. However, some prejudices are well founded. I think this prejudice comes from a number of traits prevalent in the ID movement:
1) Insistence on being taken seriously, despite a complete lack of quantitative predictions, proposals for how to test those predictions, or a single point of experimental data
2) A long history of distorting or misunderstanding the theory and supporting facts behind evolution
3) An admitted and documented political agenda
You specifically refer to scientists who simply say that the existence of an intelligent designer is possible. The problem is that most people who support ID are going far beyond that simple statement.
I agree with you that scientists who merely suggest the possibility of a designer should not be shunned, lose their jobs, etc. But if all you are saying is that an intelligent designer is possible, then as a scientist, I smile and say “That’s nice”. When a guy hands me a pamphlet about the “intrinsic gravity” of organisms which is full of newly-invented jargon and totally lacking in equations or experimental data, I smile and say “That’s nice”. The conversation is over. You don’t need a symposium or an article in the journal Nature to say that something is possible; that’s a waste of time. And you certainly don’t need to be paid $90K a year at a university to say it; that’s a waste of money, especially when your colleagues are using evolutionary “theory” to, for example, breed bacterial mutants that can be used to detect trace amounts of hazardous materials.
Science is tough. I was at a biophysics conference this weekend and there were many people there who worried that their research would not be taken seriously. These people had well-documented experiments, and mathematical models on their side. They explained in great detail what the outcome of an experiment should be if their hypothesis were true, and how this result compares to the predictions of alternative hypotheses. They drew conservative conclusions, usually making caveats like “it’s not yet conclusive…” or “we haven’t yet measured it this way…”
Yet, they were worried that their case (e.g., about the binding mechanism of some protein) just wasn’t convincing enough. Scientists are very, very critical. If you can’t make your ideas crystal clear, or if you don’t address all the possible objections to your research, people walk out of your lecture and they don’t even glance at your poster. After every single lecture, there was at least one question from the audience that called into question an assumption made, a method used, or a conclusion drawn. A great number of the people there were post-docs ultimately seeking a professorship with full funding and tenure. The vast majority of them will never get it.
If your work isn’t clear, rigorous, relevant, or supported by the data, you don’t get funded, you don’t get promoted, and you don’t get tenure. If you spend much of your time touting unsupported or unsupportable ideas, people ridicule those ideas, whether it’s ID or anything else.
My advice to ID proponents: quit whining just because you haven’t been able to produce anything scientifically rigorous. If what you’re doing is science, then show me an equation. Show me a schematic of a novel detector or experiment. Show me some data. You can believe and talk about whatever you want as a private individual, but as a scientist, you either put up or shut up.






















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February 7, 2008 at 8:43 AM
Well said!
February 7, 2008 at 9:43 AM
We’re putting up!
THE NEW DISCIPLINE!
Things will never be the same in academia after this.
There is a new discipline on the scene: physical science, the old science of cause and effect.
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DAY OF VICTORY!
The Quest for Right, a series of seven textbooks designed for the public schools, represents the ultimate marriage between an in-depth knowledge of biblical phenomena and natural and physical sciences. As a result, the several volumes have accomplished that which, heretofore, was deemed impossible: to level the playing field between those who desire a return to physical science in the classroom and those who embrace the theory of evolution. The Quest for Right turns the tide by providing an authoritative and enlightening scientific explanation of natural phenomena which will ultimately replace the unprofitable Darwinian view.
The backbone of Darwinism is not biological evolution per se, but electronic interpretation, the tenet that all physical, chemical, and biological processes result from a change in the electron structure of the atom which, in turn, may be deciphered through the orderly application of mathematics, as outlined in quantum mechanics. A few of the supporting theories are: degrading stars, neutron stars, black holes, extraterrestrial water, antimatter, the absolute dating systems, and the big bang, the explosion of a singularity infinitely smaller than the dot of an “i” from which space, time, and the massive stellar bodies supposedly sprang into being.
The philosophy rejects any divine intervention. Therefore, let the philosophy of Darwinism be judged on these specifics: electron interpretation and quantum mechanics. Conversely, the view that God is both responsible for and rules all the phenomena of the universe will stand or fall when the facts are applied. The view will not hinge on faith alone, but will be tested by the weightier principle of verifiable truths – the new discipline.
The Quest for Right is not only better at explaining natural phenomena, but also may be verified through testing. As a result, the material in the several volumes will not violate the so-called constitutional separation of church and state. Physical science, the old science of cause and effect, will have a long-term sustainability, replacing irresponsible doctrines based on whim. Teachers and students will rejoice in the simplicity of earthly phenomena when entertained by the new discipline. You will not want to miss the adventure of a lifetime that awaits you in Volume 1 of The Quest for Right, by C. David Parsons.
Visit the official website for additional information: http://questforright.com/
“A book that will change the world.” – Wayne Lin, Editor, Tate Publishing LLC
The Quest for Right in the news:
Feb. 5th – Shipped 200 copies of Volume 1 to concerned educators, religious leaders, and politicians in Florida. Even as you read this, the books are on their desks.
Mar. 2008 – Some 550 additional copies are slated to be shipped to Texas and South Carolina.
February 7, 2008 at 11:49 AM
I like Eric’s response—it’s clear, precise, and polite.
All of the “ID” I’ve come across just seems like creationism with a very thin veneer of jargon—the “Quest for Right” business above included (btw, Mr. Parsons, I notice you’re shipping the book to politicans but not to scientists. Is there a reason for that?).
Ultimately, I don’t think the question of whether or not the universe was created/designed is a scientific question—the problem with ID proponents and creationists is that they’re trying to claim scientific status for something that’s inherently non-falsifiable. That doesn’t necessarily mean the idea of a creator is false or worthless, but it’s not something we can conclusively verify with an emprical experiment, an equation, etc.
February 7, 2008 at 3:33 PM
@ David: go read about evolution than come back. You are conflating evolution with other theories.
Very interesting post Paul! What I always write on these posts is the following:
IDiots will be taken seriously when they make serious attempts to get their ideas accepted by the scientific community. But they aren’t because they know they have no evidence. They completely circumvent the scientific process by going to school boards and courts. It’s BS!
February 7, 2008 at 4:46 PM
Since the inquisition was burning scientists in the fire for several centuries for the claims that “the idea that the world is flat is garbage”, “the idea that the universe is rotating around the earth is garbage”, “the idea that the world was made in 6 days is garbage” the scientists are incredibly annoyed with religion.
And now they are just saying like they did in the past: “the idea if intelligent design is garbage”
February 7, 2008 at 5:27 PM
Hi Paul, You may already be aware of this, but just in case…. C. David Parsons who wrote the advertisement up a couple comments, is a creationist and he has been going around to different blogs posting his C—. One of the statement in his volume 1 book is that the moon along with the earth was created 6,000 years ago in a 24 hour period.
February 7, 2008 at 7:42 PM
Yeah, it’s a clue when they use a phrase like “so-called separation of Church & State” – LOL
Really great post, Paul
February 7, 2008 at 9:12 PM
ID isn’t supported by scientists, because the whole “designer” part of the theory cannot be measured, cannot be directly observed by our senses or tools that help the senses observe better, and cannot be scrutnized and subjected to the scientific method.
That’s why scientists can’t handle ID.
February 7, 2008 at 11:41 PM
Funny how you worded 1, 2, and 3. They could equally well be applied to Evolution (Theory) proponents.
Of course, knocking your argument doesn’t prove ID. The biggest problem, as another commenter wrote, is that it is tough to prove existence of the designer.
February 8, 2008 at 12:48 AM
@Dan: Thank you, Dan! Welcome to the blog!
@Parsons: I’m no scientist, but I doubt any well informed, reasonable person is not going to accept your speculations. That’s my hunch because you speak of your speculations as being potentially verifiable, rather than as having a body of evidence already in their support.
@ Baekho: I agree that the notion of a Creator is non-falsifiable, and therefore cannot be properly addressed by science. Also, I too, wonder why Parsons is sending his books to politicians rather than to scientists.
@Webs: You are of course right. The notion that school boards and politicians — rather than the scientific community — should decide what is or isn’t science is a piece of idiocy.
@Theroxylandr: Well, if you put it that way, it certainly is no wonder there’s a bit of prejudice in the scientific community against religious based criticisms of science. Welcome to the blog!
@Thewordofme: No kidding? LOL! Thank you for that bit of illuminating information! And welcome to the blog!
@DOF: Doesn’t that suggest there’s a hidden agenda in the anti-evolution movement? Perhaps they want a theocracy — a government with no separation of church and state.
@Jersey: Precisely! Well said, and welcome to the blog!
@????: I’m not sure I understand how those three points could be applied equally to the evolution side. Could you elaborate, please? Welcome to the blog!
February 8, 2008 at 1:09 AM
Great post.
ID bothers me a great deal. I think the FSM phenomenon has done a great deal to illustrate just how silly the idea of teaching this “theory” in school is.
I’d link to the FSM site, but I don’t want my comment spam-listed.
February 8, 2008 at 1:13 AM
ID bothers me too, Steve. I think if it were accepted as science, it would degrade science, reducing it to superstition.
February 8, 2008 at 2:47 AM
Sheesh, David Parsons is certainly sure that he’s sure of his facts!
And unsurprisingly, Tate Publishing is a Christian publisher – so no bias, there, Wayne!
Paul, your post was sound, and it made a lot of sense to me. More and more I’m looking for intelligent argument, and room for theories to co-exist; honesty about belief and open discourse. ID can’t represent these things; it’s an old trick dressed up as a new one.
At least creation as a myth can be believed or not, as the listener chooses; pretending ID has any scientific basis makes the justification by faith that underpins Christianity into a mockery.
February 8, 2008 at 2:55 AM
Hey! Welcome to the blog, Green Witch! I could not agree with you more that a reasonable person can believe the universe was created but that it takes something “other than reason” to believe there is a scientific basis for asserting the universe was created. And like you, I don’t get how one can say they have faith if they insist their faith is demonstrated by science.
February 8, 2008 at 5:05 AM
ID isn’t even accepted in Theocracies like Iran. There, they laugh at the ID people here. Einstein believed in God, but that’s not good enough for the Bible thumpers. They have to ram it down the throat of young kids to get them indoctrinated early. They leave no room for faith, and that is their crucial error. Love’s equation is silence.
February 8, 2008 at 5:12 AM
Hi Darvish! I rather like the poetry of that line, “Love’s equation is silence.” Thank you for that!
February 8, 2008 at 6:51 AM
Man, so do i, so do i hate those ID people, but i guess in the end i can see what that is all about. Or maybe all this fuss made me realize something important: that all beliefs are chosen. I choose to believe in science. ID people chose to believe in one interpretation of the Bible that specifically says that there is no evolution. For very obvious, banal things (like if i release this ball it will fall to the ground) my experience is restrictive as to what i can believe in. But in more complex matters the availability of too many ways to measure things just makes belief dependant on choice more than on experience. I believe in science more because my grandfather and family did so, him being a great scientist. I do think ID’s are on the wrong track, but i must admit that their choice-of-believing in those creativist ideas is supposed to be ok. The reason i am not giving them an ounce of my time is that creationism is not a complex idea. — But in the end, what i really think is the source of scientists’ prejudice against ID is that this whole fuss is SO, but SO much alike “Galileo’s affair”. In the end, it became clear that no, the bible did not say the sun rotated around the earth, nor did it say the contrary. The Bible simply was not concerned with modern astronomy. I don’t see much difference with modern biology either…
February 8, 2008 at 6:56 AM
Hear hear. *taps table*
February 8, 2008 at 7:07 AM
Hi Lessertruth! It’s good to see you again! Have you ever had a chance to read up on the Dover Intelligent Design case? In that case, the Federal judge came right out and called the IDers liars. For me, there’s no moral equivalence between the IDers and the scientists. One group habitually lies, the other — so far as I can see — doesn’t.
@Ian: Welcome to the blog!
February 8, 2008 at 10:39 AM
Well said.
And still, I think that any comparison of science and a religious theory has to fail.
Sciences are like a apples, all placed to build up a pyramid.
Religions are more a huge tank of apple juice mixed with some citrons (if you add some obscure sects).
Anyway, kind regards.
February 8, 2008 at 7:47 PM
“My advice to ID proponents: quit whining just because you haven’t been able to produce anything scientifically rigorous.”
My advice to ID proponents is they should go back to the cave they came from. Of course scientists laugh at ID creationists. ID is just another word for magic. Who wouldn’t laugh at people who invoke magic? The ID proponents are not fooling anyone when they pretend their childish ideas are science. Everyone knows they are liars. For example the Discovery Institute creationists are constantly lying about science every single day. The Dishonesty Institute never misses an opportunity to attack science education. They know they’re liars, that’s what they do for a living.
February 11, 2008 at 7:13 AM
If one chooses to “believe” in science that is their choice. There is no prerequisite to science stating one must believe in it. Science is a way to constantly test and understand the world.
Do you need to “believe” that 1+1=2? Maybe, but I bet someone smarter with Math theorems than me could easily show you so that your belief wouldn’t really be necessary. Likewise, if you talked to an evolutionary biologist, a “belief” in evolution wouldn’t be necessary. They could easily explain everything to you.
But a belief in ID is necessary. They have no proofs or science for their theories. If they did they wouldn’t circumvent the scientific process to get their theories in textbooks.
February 16, 2008 at 1:21 PM
@darvish:
Great post, one clarification: Einstein didn’t believe in God as we think of it, in a theological sense; rather, he envisioned a God as embodied by the laws and structure of the universe itself. God as the anthropomorphism of a very structured and sensical universe. Thus his statement, “God does not play dice.” If God did, the universe wouldn’t be as discoverable as it is .
March 10, 2008 at 2:43 PM
Excellent post! I agree wholeheartedly. I published a post on my blog about the situation here in Florida. Religious fundamentalist are trying to sneak creationism into our schools under the guise of ID. I thought this was a battle we fought and settled in Dayton, Tennessee in 1925. It was called the Scopes Monkey trial. Yet, even today there are people like C. David Parsons who continue to spam intelligent blogs with his spamvertisement for a work of science fiction. You are more generous than I. I cut the crap out of his post and responded by defining the difference between belief and science.
Great blog! I’ll be back.
March 12, 2008 at 4:21 AM
Thank you, Da Frog, for the information about what’s going on in Florida and for the compliment!